IFR Currency

Guest Discussion
#1

Although this is a SR2N forum, I hope somebody out there can answer a question I have on the regulations concerning IFR currency. This might be interesting for all.

The regs state that in order to be able to file IFR, a pilot must (among other things), have performed 6 instrument approaches either in actual or simulated conditions in the past 6 months. I can’t find a complete definition of “actual” conditions. Here’s the scenario:

A typical approach might be the ILS approach at Prescott, AZ. The plate shows that the IAF is on the localizer (Humty). From there you proceed to a VOR and do the usual “twists and turns” etc. until you’re safely on the ground.

The question is: What part of the approach has to be IMC to be qualified as actual? Anytime before the IAF? Once you are past the IAF?

I can’t find anything in the regs that define this. Most of the instructors I’ve talked to aren’t sure but “guess” that if you are in IMC when you cross the IAF and then complete the approach in VFR, it legal.

I realize that it’s all about honesty when filling out your logbook, but I’m interested if someone has “the answer”.

Walt N224AZ

#2

The very experienced CFII who gave me my phase check just prior to my checkride confirmed that the definition of the conditions required to log an instrument approach are not specified in the FARs or AIM . However, he considers an actual approach one in which IMC is encountered at or beyond the FAF not IAF.

George Savage

#3

This is a good question for the AOPA forum called “Cloud Busters,” which is excellent for questions like this one.

#4

I recall reading in one of the legitimate aviation magazines (AOPA Pilot, Flying, IFR, I donÕt remember which) a similar question. The answer given was if you are flying solely by reference to instruments, once ATC states Òcleared for the approachÓ, it may be considered logable, even if you break out VFR right after that.

Kevin SR20 N55KS (#414)

#5

Walt,
Here’s an snippet from the April 2001 article of “Flight Training” magazine (published by AOPA and available for 6 months free of charge to all new student pilots, which is why I’m hoping it’s “okay” to copy part of it here!). The “Rod” is Rod Machado, who answers questions in that magazine.
Question:
Hi Rod,
HereÂ’s a quick question about logging IFR time and approaches. IÂ’m on an IFR flight plan and spend part of it in true instrument meteorological conditions (IMC). I break out at 4,000 feet in visual meteorological conditions and fly the ILS approach in VMC conditions. Is that a loggable approach for instrument currency?
Thanks,
Terrance
Answer:
Greetings Terrance,
In the May-June 1982 issue of Flight Forum, the FAA said, “…In order to log approaches toward IFR currency, the approaches must be carried at least through the so-called critical elements. This could include con- ducting the approach to a landing, to the minimum altitude and\or missed approach point, or through the approved missed approach procedure.”
In regard to breaking out from IMC to VMC on the approach, hereÂ’s what the FAA had to say in their July-August 1990 issue of Flight Forum. “…Once you have been cleared for and have initiated an instrument approach in IMC, you may log that approach for instrument currency, regardless of the altitude at which you break out of the clouds. When doing a simulated IFR approach you should fly the prescribed instrument approach procedure to DH (decision height) or MDA (minimum descent altitude) to maximize the training benefit.”
Since you didnÂ’t begin your approach in IMC, you canÂ’t log that approach toward meeting the instrument currency (recent flight experience) requirements.
Steve

#6

A typical approach might be the ILS approach at Prescott, AZ. The plate shows that the IAF is on the localizer (Humty). From there you proceed to a VOR and do the usual “twists and turns” etc. until you’re safely on the ground.
<<<<
I looked at that approach, and am wondering under what circumstances I would fly from the IAF (HUMTY) to the VOR? I see a transition route going from the VOR to the IAF, but nothing the other direction. It seems to me that from the IAF I would stay on the localizer course for the procedure turn. Thanks!

#7

Thanks for the input. I’ll try it and post what I have found.

Walt N224AZ

#8

This question has come up often in AOPA’s “Cloud Busters” forum. As others have posted, there’s no real definition. I’ve heard everything from any IMC at all after the IAF, all the way to having to have IMC to minimums.

FWIW, I subscribe to the former.

Joe Mazza

#9

Thanks. You saved me a nickel. Actually the question was more out of curiosity, as opposed to a real need. It’s 360 days of severe clear in Prescott, AZ. I do my currency with foggles and a safety dude. When there are clouds, it’s during monsoon season and that’s when I stay home under severe cover.

Thanks again,

Walt N224AZ

#10

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the “answer”. Actually the question was more out of curiosity, as opposed to a real need. It’s 360 days of severe clear in Prescott, AZ. I do my currency with foggles and a safety dude. When there are clouds, it’s during monsoon season and that’s when I stay home under severe cover.

Thanks again,

Walt N224AZ

#11

Since you didnÂ’t begin your approach in IMC, you canÂ’t log that approach toward meeting the instrument currency (recent flight experience) requirements.

If that was the only measure of an approach in actual, then almost none of mine are, including my last one where I went to MDA in the soup and had to fly the missed, since in coastal CA you are very often (almost always) in the clear at the FAF, but then the fun starts. Sure seemed like an approach in actual to me!

I think that what it really boils down to is being honest with yourself about what you’re doing and how proficient you are. If you only fly six approaches in six months (particularly under the hood) it is hard to honestly claim to be proficient when the time comes to do it for real. Log the ones that pass the laugh test: Would I have survived without instruments? This seems like the truest test to me. If you fly enough approaches to be proficient, you won’t worry about whether or not to count a few of them.

Nobody’s watching but you, and you’re the only one for which it matters (your life depends on it) so log what you feel is proper.

#12

“Since you didnÂ’t begin your approach in IMC, you canÂ’t log that approach toward meeting the instrument currency (recent flight experience) requirements.”

I think what they meant is, if you were in the soup and came into VMC before being cleared for the approach, it doesn’t count.

Walt N224AZ

PS: I agree with your thoughts on being honest with yourself. The rules are not going to help, if you can’t cut it when your in the clouds.