I do know of very well known āaviation personalitiesā who who post under more than one online persona, and some of them run two personas with diametrically opposed opinions. One pilot I know runs four of them (well, four I know about) spanning the whole spectrum from novice to sky-god.
In 12 years of TB ownership I have never heard of a TB pilot called Art Pileggi (certainly not on the Socata ownersā group) but one well known TB guy was for years posting as Sabine Behrle (āsheā was aggressively pro Cirrus I believe) in German forums, so perhaps Art Pileggi was the same person working the other way? It must take a lot of energy to do that.
But thatās not me. I am a Czech born TB20 owner, website URL posted above, and one of the two admins of euroga.org. No Cirrus bashing goes on there, either; in fact we have a good number of Cirrus owners there.
I knew Art Pileggi. He was in the same flying club I belonged to before getting the Cirrus and we both had orders in for an SR20 back in 1999. He never owned TB of any type. In fact, he never owned an aircraft until he had a partnership to get an SR20. He complained about everything and got ride of the plane. Have not heard from him in years but someone said he got into the LSA market and did not like them either.
Hi Peter Holt or is that Peter Holmes or is that Peter Holy
Good to see your still getting things half right ??? its the half wrong I think that got you barred from the Socata site.
We have a guy in Australia. He does use his real name but he also has a problem with getting things half right and preaching to new owners. Itās the danger of advising people with mistruth. Lucky for me I believe in facts and found this guy to know nothing about Cirrus and went on to buy one myself.
You said
Socata parts are not generally more expensive than US aircraft parts
Peter are you in politics now, youāve got to be joking.
As to the undercarriage maintenance yes your later aircraft has a better hydraulic pump. However the earlier models with the Prestolite pump need overhauling every five years by the maintenance manual and thatās about as long as it lasts. The last time I got a price from the factory for my TB20 five years ago, it was $7000. The pressure switches failed regularly at $1000 each. You can upgrade to the later model pump. I think the price I got five years ago was $30,000.
The TB20 and Cirrus are great aircraft. Both handle and perform exceptionally well. However the TB 20 is no longer built. And if it was built today. it would be so behind the market, it would not be funny.
As I said on the Socata site before. Sorry you would not have seen it, your not allowed thereā¦ If you can afford a Cirrus you will love it. And you would never go back .If not keep flying in TB 20 and bagging the Cirrus to satisfy yourself that the TB 20 is better.
All the best to you Peter we have a lot of people on this site who really do know the Cirrus aircraft . And if I can suggest to you, you would best be utilised preaching on your own site in Europe.
PS ā¦ Ben have you looked at Cessna 152 and 172 they may fit your skills and needs
Awaiting your reply Ben it will probably start with you donāt know me so how can you make that opinion.
Lol well finally Iāve now spent time flying both the Socata TB20 and a new Cirrus SR22 GTS. Both planes are fantastic. If priced the same, a tough decision. Take a 2001 Socata TB 20 and 2001 Cirrus SR22. Both cost about the same but the Cirrus will have better avionics and the parachute. Insurance and maintenance will be higher on the Socata TB20 since itās a retract. Parts both expensive. Iām going to get checked out in the club Cirrus to see how I like the side yoke. The hat trim switch on the Cirrus takes getting used to. Right now spending 200K on a used plane or 600K for a new Cirrus is out of my budget at the moment unless I win the lottery. Fortunately I can afford to rent the Cirrus but alas finding a Socata TB20 to rent is rather difficult since very few were made or rented as leasebacks. We had one for a while that I was going to checked out in but the owner sold it.
I got booted off the Socata site because the owner of the server does not allow anybody to disagree with him. So all posts now are from people who always agree with him. All dozen or so of them. He essentially gives the āfactory lineā - has to, as he also runs the TBM site so needs to work with the factory.
The only way to pay $7k is to have a dumb maintenance company. You should get the pump mfg overhauled.
The $30k is fiction.
The $1000 hydraulic pressure switch is real but mine has never packed up and neither have most peoplesā. You can buy it as a generic part for half the price - along with all the other electrical parts concerned with the landing gear.
Itās the same with any aircraft. If you have a dumb A&P or 145 and they buy everything by the IPC P/N then they will pay loads more for everything. Which is good for business because they get some 25% margin on parts supply. Nobody should buy parts from the airframe manufacturer - they can be 5x the price. Same for Cirrus. This parts sourcing malpractice is rife throughout the GA industry, fed by most owners being non-proactive. And if an aircraft is syndicated, chances are that nobody is really keeping on top of the stuff, so they pay top dollar for everything. Even the trim screws get ordered from the airframe manufacturerā¦ Itās more so owners of new aircraft who like the nice dealership setup and like to drop the aircraft off with a key left on the seat.
You are right on one thing though: the TBs are no longer made, so if you want new smelling leather, the latest avionics, and a chute to pull if things go bad, you have to buy a Cirrus. Or maybe the Cessna 400, which is a bit faster and burns a bit more fuel, but has no chute.
We have not meet but ,I have meet with many that have meet you ā¦ Why do you use so many names. What I can not stand is pretentious and pretenders. Does that answer your ? Yes your right about being kicked off the Socata site , It sounds like you think you knew more than andrew ???..
What is the factory overhaul price for a prestolite pump ? And to change to a oildene newer pump ?. Being a mechanic myself ā¦ I may know a little more than you . But you like to be the expert ?. Its easy to waffle peter ā¦you may find it hard here ā¦
Just to help you out a little prestolite closed down, so it may be a bit hard to get them to overhaul ā¦ But you did sound like you knew what you where talking about . But as always not right. If $30000 for a pump change to oildene is wrong . Please advise the new price? Homework and knowing what your talking about , would be a great help ā¦
I found you on the Socata site. Gramsy is not your real name. Shall I do what you do and post it? I wonāt. Most people here donāt use their real names.
Peter holy Really Gramsy not my real name ?? Is Glen Grams which I post under . And Gramsy my nicknameā¦ Peter you have been court out ā¦ Cirrus owners are not stupid. Post all the crap you like. But we see thought you old mate
All the best peter holy ,from Glen Grams
PSā¦ Peter donāt forget your barred from the Socata Site ?
It is a requirement of the COPA Online Media policy that everyone register using their real name:
āCOPA policy requires that registered users and members accurately identify themselves by using their true first and last name, which will appear in all posts and in their profile, and their true address, which will be visible to others only as specified in the User Profile and in accordance with the Privacy Policy. The use of pseudonyms or āhandlesā is not permitted.ā
Your user name might be different, but your real name must be used in the registration and available to all other COPA members (via clicking on the user name).
Well, it looks like the policy just changed! My real name is showing up at the top of the post now rather than wjlong. If that change sticks, I agree that it is a very positive step forward.
The problem, however, on a site which requires real names is that people who have an unusual name and want to hide it for whatever reason (professional or employment restriction being the most common and IMHO justifiable reasons) will simply choose a different but plausible name. Every currently active site I know which requires real names is thus full of made-up but plausible looking names (e.g. Thomas Smith) as a result. One exception, from a very long time ago, was Compuserve, where the name used on your credit card was also the name you posted under and you could not change it. As a result, little useful discussion appeared on there as soon as topics got a bit controversial and Compuserve groups died as soon as Usenet became mainstream. I donāt know if COPA implements such a linkage but in any case it would work reliably with credit card payments only.
You have pretty much answered your own question. They are not making the Socata range aircraft. Insurance on TB20 costs more (?) and maintenance and running costs are also higher.
I just like to mention a couple of points, firstly some of you may not know this but even French air force are using the Cirrus SR2x for training. Of course, there is this point about how a patriotic nation like French whom are famous for using their own manufactured goods opt for a Cirrus aircraft in preference over their own aircraft. I leave the answer to the Socata pilots.
The second point is about training, donāt insurance companies in US require the pilots of Cirrus Aircraft to go through the Cirrus Transition Course? If this is the case, then anticipate; to fly the Cirrus you will need the knowledge of the aircraft and then train and demonstrate the ability to fly and manage it. This can generally take a good few days if not a complete week for a low hour PPL in an SR20 not SR22. Obviously this is only the case if you are like myself and not one of those super man pilots who donāt need any training and often come across as knowing it all.
When you buy an aircraft, it isnāt just the aircraft itself, it is the level support and convenience. Think about when the aircraft goes wrong, how quickly can you find an engineer to get it up and running again?
One final point, the training syllabus recommended by Cirrus (stipulated with new aircraft) at this moment of time is excellent and second to none. Training alone should tilt the scale towards the cirrus aircraft, never mind the aircraft.
Looks like no one here likes pretenders, and Falure to comply is being banned. You know how that goesā¦
Failure to comply with the guidelines, or a recurrent pattern of offenses may result in being banned from COPA. Members removed as a result of this policy shall have their most recent annual dues payment refunded pro-rata
Your Identity
COPA policy requires that registered users and members accurately identify themselves by using their true first and last name, which will appear in all posts and in their profile, and their true address, which will be visible to others only as specified in the User Profile and in accordance with the Privacy Policy. The use of pseudonyms or āhandlesā is not permitted.
