My landings are fine from the right. Thanks…
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I learned a lot from the many pilots who shared similar circumstances and also learned that there is disagreement about the wiggle issue. I also learned of a NTSB report of a similar person who had an accident after choosing to not rotate and who was alive but had a wrecked plane. I hope nobody on this forum has that decision to make at 70 knots.
As to this basic maneuver of pushing the bar down it still was never mentioned by cirrus after 2 discussion and mentioning this thread. They said if you push front and back and it doesn’t slip you have it locked end of story. I did find feeling the bar helpful but very difficult for my body size and my plane. What was frustrating is that I don’t just jump in the plane and take off. I check every passengers seat belts and btw they should be down the hips to avoid spleen or liver damage. The assumption was that because I posted I must not check my seat?
Folks who post are likely inquisitive and wanting to be safe and learn, not there to bitch or be blamed for something which is a mechanical issue…constructive comments are what posters want.
You have no idea how many hours I have and the wisdom is awesome with this group but don’t presume you are wise just because you’re a member. I am a member as well… but told “says the guy” who can’t adjust a seat or some BS.
After speaking to
Cirrus it was made clear never wiggle except aft and for front and back…don’t twist the spine. I am so glad for the smart and helpful people on COPA. This has been a weird year but this year especially I notice people saying things on the internet they would never say face to face…thanks for all the nice informative posts.
Blue skies…
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Response from Cirrus. No mention of wiggling or testing fore aft or pushing on the bar down–
Dear Dr. Mahon:
Here’s what the Pilot’s Operating Handbook says:
Front Seats
The front seats are adjustable fore and aft and the seat backs can be reclined for passenger comfort or folded forward for rear seat access. Integral headrests are provided. The fore and aft travel path is adjusted through the seat position control located below the forward edge of the seat cushion. The seat track is angled upward for forward travel so that shorter people will be positioned slightly higher as they adjust the seat forward. Recline position is controlled through levers located on each side of the seat backs. Depressing the recline release control while there is no pressure on the seat back will return the seat back to the full up position.
To position front seat fore and aft:
- Lift the position control handle.
- Slide the seat into position.
- Release the handle and check that the seat is locked in place.
To adjust recline position: - Actuate and hold the seat back control lever.
- Position the seat back to the desired angle.
- Release the control lever.
Have you noticed the red decal, right under the flap switch?
Will do Mark and I appreciated the NTSB report…have a good one…
I don’t know how much clearer Cirrus could be that the control handle should be fully down.
This is the first lesson I give anyone, in any airplane. Seat secure in place.
Still this gentleman will find reasons to blame others.
Oh well!
What does the electronic ignition have to do with the… oh, never mind.
I have about 200 hours in an SR20 and double checking (by stressing) the seat latch is now a part of my do list prior to taxi.
I learned this the hard way… twice. First with me in the pilot side just prior to TO. Where fortunately, the slippage was just a couple of notches and no loss off control. The second time, my instructor’s seat just after TO slid back.
As I progressed from student to private, I have trained with 8 instructors from cirrus branded schools and not one drew my attention to the dangers of not affirming the correct latching/testing of the seat.
I am glad the OP surfaced the topic as a warning to us early career pilots.
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I have an in between condition, left pin locks but right doesn’t sometimes. Seat still clicks as if locked. Unfortunately, I need the seat full forward. Checking the bar is the only way to know pins are seated, but knowing what down feels like is critical.
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Kirk,
I’m glad you posted about the issue. If it heightens awareness, you might help someone else avoid an accident.
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I think this highlights some of the opportunity for an engineering/mechanical solution; that the current one is imperfect. It should be obvious, not ambiguous.
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The Eclipse has an additional lock that locks into the slide rail behind the seat to act as a second line of defense against this. Seems like it’d be easy enough to engineer something like that into the Cirrus.
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Kirk, same happened to me on my very first solo. Age 16. Cessna 152.
Have also experienced this problem in every Cirrus I have flown. Important to determine your optimum seat position, feel the lever come all the way up, and feel/verify it slides all the way down into a fully engaged position. Firmly rock forward and aft to ensure it is secure. Also very important to do during your before landing check, if you adjusted the seat back anytime during flight. I feel and check during the break check.
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On my seat, when the lock bar is fully down, I can insert my fingers between the bar and the bottom of the seat up to my knuckles. Bar up, nary a pinky. With the seat fully back the pins won’t engage, so checking the gap when back there is easy.
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I had my seat inspected after it slid back twice at rotation and it was deemed to be OK. BUT the problem is no service center explained that you had to wiggle back and forth while pressing down hard on the seat adjustment bar and feel and hear the locking pin “snap” down in place. Fortunatly an on line COPA member clued me in . I damn near lost it but managed to stay centered and back on the thankfully long Scottsdale runway but not without over heating the brakes. I now also engage the command bars and can continue on instruments if necessary.
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Jim,
In your experience would the Crew Seat Longitudinal Alignment procedure be able to correct a seat that locks into place easily in the more aft positions but resists locking into place at the forward positions?
…or does the procedure only work if the seat is misaligned and won’t lock easily throughout all forward and aft positions?
Best regards,
Scott
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Yes.
Most middles are worn. The fronts or rears not so much.
At some point the rails will need replacement…
Like the Cessna issue…
Jim,
Thank you.
I was looking at the “Special Tool” (Part # 15936-001) for doing that alignment procedure.
Looks like a bit over an Aviation Monetary Unit for that item.
Golly.
Best regards,
Scott
We did it a little more low budget…